They can’t seem to see anything wrong with their gospel but it’s just like any other religion. Man saving himself by his own good works. Decision Theology is awful! And these people are leading many to a false security. Their think they are going to stand before God in the own filthy rags but they can’t even see how dirty they are.

I guess they just don’t want to give Christ’s all the Glory like He deserves.

We need to pray for these men and woman.

Ok, here goes!!

You wrote: “….By obedience to His will?…”.

No, it is by obedience to His will that saves me, not my obedience, but His!

I like what one of the Elders of G.O. Vancouver pointed out years about the fruits of my flesh and the Fruit of the Spirit.

My flesh can only produce fruits of the flesh, inherited from Adam.

But God can produce His fruit in my flesh by His Spirit!

Now I just sit back and enjoy the ride! Now, I too, can experience this:::>

Gal 5:3 I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law.
Gal 5:4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.
Gal 5:5 For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness.
Gal 5:6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love.

Thanks again Pastor Tom. It is indeed a gladdening Joy to read your words about His Words of Wisdom!!

michael
eureka, ca.

The will of God is revealed to us in His Law– this is His good, pleasing, and perfect will, as the Psalms say over and over again. If we ask anything according to His will, the apostle John says, He hears us, and we receive what we ask. James here is saying the same thing: if we ask as our Lord Jesus Christ asked and commanded, that the Father’s will be done on earth that it is in heaven, we will always receive what we ask for.

God grant us release from sinful desires, which war against our souls and seek anything but the fulfillment of the Law of God, and repentance when we fall short.

you wrote above: “….That can be understood in a narrow sense but it certainly cannot mean that our sins are gone. …”

Exactly!

It seems the longer I live on the earth serving my neighbors the stronger it is His Faith is that grows in me because of that very fact.

Now I don’t have to hide my head in the sand. Now, in His Hope, I can, by His Faith, serve my neighbors, even though my sins are not gone, but very much alive in my flesh!

It is only when I leave this flesh pot at my passing away from the earth, will it truly be said that I am indeed separated from my sins. Until then, by Faith and Patience, in this world, I enjoy the promises of God.

Now the Law, which is Holy, Righteous and Pure, does its work in me, setting forth for me to see the law of sin and death.

Now the Gospel, which is Holy, Righteous and Pure, does its work in me, setting forth for me the service that beckons me to serve my neighbors for Christ’s sake.

And so I point to these words of Jesus too, as you have pointed to them yourself when visiting and serving us here in my church going about making proper distinctions between the Law and Gospel:::>

Mat 25:34 Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.
Mat 25:35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me,
Mat 25:36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’
Mat 25:37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink?
Mat 25:38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?
Mat 25:39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’
Mat 25:40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’

michael
eureka, ca.

when you were out here in California a couple of years ago teaching in my Church you opened us up to a good illustration and understanding similar to the teaching of this article on 1 John 5:15. You showed us what it means to ask in His Faith according to His Will and not in our natural faith that we were born with. You asked us to look at, what some deem the sleeping and uncaring, Savior, who was in one of “many” boats on the sea that stormy and windy gale force winds day, so great a sudden squall, the waves were filling the “boats”. Cf. Mark 4:36. Their natural faith caused them to believe they were going to perish. Had they understood His Faith and His Will properly they quickly would have realized that the Scripture taught He was going to die at the hands of ungodly men crucified on a Cross not die by drowning in the sea.

In that particular boat that Jesus was sleeping in, notwithstanding the fact that all the other boats following that boat were equally experiencing the same grave circumstances of life that day, the disciples, not of His Faith, but of the kind of natural faith “circumstances” avail upon us to rely upon from birth, woke Him up proclaiming, “Jesus, don’t you care that we are going to perish today”? Jesus wakes up and rebukes the storm and the sea instantly becomes calm for everyone in all the boats on the sea that day. He then promptly rebukes the sailors for their “lack” of utilizing His Faith and maybe, more to the point, rebukes them for exercising their great faith instead of the gift of Faith He gave them already. As you pointed out when you were here, they were using theirs and not His Faith to deal with the circumstances that were so quickly brought upon them.
That Faith, His Faith, if they had understood the Scriptures correctly, would have taught them how to deal with that circumstance. They would have already understood that He was going to die another way, by what means and outside Jerusalem. Had they understood that Truth of Scripture, they would have discarded their natural faith in those present circumstances that day and rose up and used His Faith available to everyone who will do the Will of God in this world His Way and rebuked the storm? By His Faith they would have summarily rebuked the storm instead of waking Him up and accusing Him of not caring for their lives. Obviously He cared for them as He was there asking them to follow Him! By the way, when we are using our own natural faith in the circumstances we face each day in this generation, we tend to be blinded and not realize that there will be True benefit to all involved in the same situation where His Faith is needed. He lets His rain fall on the just and the unjust! Great harm will come upon everyone who does not believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God, even in today’s world.

He taught them how He was going to die already, by whose hands and by what means and where. Clearly if they had understood what the meaning was in the Scriptures He was teaching them, they would have realized at a minimum that He was not going to perish by drowning in the sea that day and since He was in their boat, they most likely were not going to perish that day either. Only His Faith makes sense out of the Will of God, Scripture and our present circumstances.

When we learn to understand Scripture with our natural faith we will be filled with fears and not understand the promises of God nor comprehend the adversity that comes to test the Faith once delivered to the Saints that works in our lives too. What this false faith movement does is blind us so that we do not see clearly God’s intentions and His reality as foretold in Scripture already. His Word will not come back to Him void. Godliness and content is great gain, not a “means” of great gain as the faith teachers teach falsely. Our natural faith always opposes God’s Will and purpose and voids His Grace in our lives.

He does not teach us anywhere in Scripture to name it and claim it and live it in our day as the King’s kids according to our will and purpose to please us. That is impossible. No, His Faith is given to us to please Him in every good work that He deems is possible for us to do. His yoke is easy and His burden is light. Without His Faith it is impossible to please Him or do good works. Natural faith is deceitful and this deadly faith comes naturally working in us at birth and it brings ruin upon this sort of believer. We inherited this kind of faith from Adam. His Faith kills it. It is His Faith alone that can kill it. Whatever God gives us to do will be possible for us to do so that He gets all the Glory. Whatever we ask of God to do that is not of His Will is impossible for Him to do for us because He cannot sin. This kind of prayer does not bring Him Glory. It is a vain prayer prayed with a vain imagination to fulfill our vain lusts and the will of the devils. That is why in one breath Jesus blessed Peter when he answered correctly according to the Will of God and then moments later He rebukes Satan in Peter saying he sets his mind on the things of man and not on the Will of God:

Mat 16:21 From that time Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised.
Mat 16:22 And Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him, saying, “Far be it from you, Lord! This shall never happen to you.”
Mat 16:23 But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me. For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man.”

michael
Eureka, Ca.

this brings out an interesting argument Paul the Apostle makes when arguing for the establishment of the Law “in the New Testament” and the results of the Law, righteousness, to all who keep it? We better not die without it, the works of the Law of Righteousness, or else! Yikes!!

Afterall he writes what appears to some a silly admonition here:

Rom 3:31 Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law.

By virtue of that claim, Paul is saying Christianity is for keeping the Law of Righteousness! It is the Law of Righteousness that was perfectly kept that saves a wretch like me.

And according to Jesus Himself, if our “righteousness’ does not exceed that of the Pharisees and Saduccees, we are in big trouble!

He picked up His axe and swung it at those who were doing just as Keith points in Amos when we read things like this in the Gospels:::>

Mat 9:1 And getting into a boat he crossed over and came to his own city.
Mat 9:2 And behold, some people brought to him a paralytic, lying on a bed. And when Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “Take heart, my son; your sins are forgiven.”
Mat 9:3 And behold, some of the scribes said to themselves, “This man is blaspheming.”
Mat 9:4 But Jesus, knowing their thoughts, said, “Why do you think evil in your hearts?
Mat 9:5 For which is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Rise and walk’?
Mat 9:6 But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”–he then said to the paralytic–”Rise, pick up your bed and go home.”

The “sacrificial” Jews under the “old covenant/testament” didn’t let it go and pressed Him further to which Jesus grabs the nut and cracks it wide open for everyone to eat, here:

Mat 9:11 And when the Pharisees saw this, they said to his disciples, “Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?”
Mat 9:12 But when he heard it, he said, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick.
Mat 9:13 Go and learn what this means, ‘I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.’ For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.”

One of the best hallmarks of this argument, in my judgment, is with these verses found in Hebrews. The issue is not keeping the sacrificial requirements, but, receiving His Faith passively so that “He can” actively impart the results of the keeping of the Law of Righteousness to those who cannot keep it, which fruit is, “imputed Righteousness” to violators of it and hence, by this imputation one is restored to the Right standing with God Adam destroyed in the Garden:::>

Heb 9:11 But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come, then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation)
Heb 9:12 he entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption.
Heb 9:13 For if the blood of goats and bulls, and the sprinkling of defiled persons with the ashes of a heifer, sanctify for the purification of the flesh,
Heb 9:14 how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without blemish to God, purify our conscience from dead works to serve the living God.

As your “preached” sermon concludes, the only souls who would differ from this sermon would be those seekers of self rightesous seeking self glory! The rest of us are already dead in our trespasses and sins and already made alive in Christ by the death that He suffered for us so the Life that He now lives in service to the Living God He does for us who otherwise could not by sacrifice or any other means live!

I admit it Pastor Tom, I answered correctly to those two questions and have come to agree with you that the answers I gave were errors!

I believe it would be a correct assertion that only a Theologian of Glory would answer the way I did and we normally do, when asked those two questions:

The first question is, “How is the Bible divided?”

and

After they answer, the second question is, “What is meant by the Old Testament and the New Testament?”

For me, I have to express my gratitude for the brothers here who decided to introduce us to “your” way of thinking, Pastor Tom, because I have found that the way you think is more closely in line with the way the Bible teaches we are to think, that is, we are to think the Way God thinks!

What is the surprise is, it is not a normal way of thinking!

Thanks again for such a lucid message of Law and Gospel putting these things into the right context with wrong answers to right questions!

michael
eureka, ca.

Great post!

However, I have a question. Is it really accurate to say that under the “Old Covenant obedience was a matter of meritorious works?” The ritual sacrificial system was about faith was it not. Isn’t that teh concern God expresses through Amos – He hates the feasts – not because of the feast itself but because the people were going about it in a faithless manner? It is true that it became to be viewed as a works righteous sor tof thing – but that was not the way God instituted it. Isn’t that so?

there you go again Pastor Tom, inciting me to want to have the answer and know why some go to heaven and some go to hell! grrrr!

Why would it matter whether or not I know or don’t know while I am alive here on earth, if, by His Act of Grace, He is enlightening me “daily” with His Faith to believe and receive His forgiveness?

Well, I believe I have an answer!

Because the lust for self glory in my flesh just wants to have an advantage over your ignorance of knowing!

I have a saying that kills me!

The solution to this pollution is not dilution but absolution!

Now, the question for a theologian of glory is, “how do I absolve myself and stand justified before God without any help from you?”

Or, why can’t “me forgiving me” work, God? You forgive so why can’t I forgive?

Or, [my all time favorite], well the reason God let me know why some go to heaven and some go to hell is so that I can assist as many as I can go to heaven and not hell!

Or, or, or! Grrrrrr!

The only solution to not knowing is believing in the free offer of His gracious absolution and receive His rest and without preconditions, then, get to doing His good works, not mine and serve my neighbor.

Having a proper understanding, so as to make the proper distinction between the Law and Gospel, frees me from being “the Judge” of why some go to heaven and some go to hell. It keeps me out of other people’s business and frees me to be a minister of reconciliation proclaiming the Good News that Jesus Christ saves His people from their sins!

michael
eureka, ca.

I think of two “True” Biblical accounts of Hell, one a literal observation, and two, an imagination, both from the Old Testament portion of the Bible. I also think of the one and only account of an actual event, by some argument and a parabolic event, by some argument, but an event, nevertheless that Jesus tells of Lazarus and the rich man. Note that nowhere in that accounting in the New Testament does it appear Jesus is giving the rich man opportunity to leave the place of judgment he was assigned by the Grace of God. I would think that if God wanted us to “believe” there is a possibility for us to be retrieved from there after going there He would have made it plain somewhere in the Gospels that there is a second chance?

Here are the two Old Testament events I am thinking about that, definitely in my mind, “refute” 23 minutes in hell as an actual event. They are when Korah, Dathan and Abiram and all their own bloodline experience the judgment of God when the earth opens up and Scripture records they fall into Sheol, warts and all, men, women and children, into the everlasting judgment of God, and at Job 18, where Bildad describes what happens to the “soul” of a person being “torn” from their tent:

Num 16:28 And Moses said, “Hereby you shall know that the LORD has sent me to do all these works, and that it has not been of my own accord.
Num 16:29 If these men die as all men die, or if they are visited by the fate of all mankind, then the LORD has not sent me.
Num 16:30 But if the LORD creates something new, and the ground opens its mouth and swallows them up with all that belongs to them, and they go down alive into Sheol, then you shall know that these men have despised the LORD.”
Num 16:31 And as soon as he had finished speaking all these words, the ground under them split apart.
Num 16:32 And the earth opened its mouth and swallowed them up, with their households and all the people who belonged to Korah and all their goods.
Num 16:33 So they and all that belonged to them went down alive into Sheol, and the earth closed over them, and they perished from the midst of the assembly.

and

Job 18:14 He is torn from the tent in which he trusted and is brought to the king of terrors.
Job 18:15 In his tent dwells that which is none of his; sulfur is scattered over his habitation.
Job 18:16 His roots dry up beneath, and his branches wither above.

you wrote: “….For God always answers every prayer and instantly. His answers are yes, no or wait.

In reality, they are always “yes.”…. ”

Now talk about “ridiculous”; that’s ridiculous and certainly falls so close to the center of my soul. I have to agree though, that you indeed fall in league with the likes of Jesus and Isaiah for being way past commonsense understanding!

That fact that I always want “my” prayers answered “yes” from God is a given, seeing the wretched lustful selfcentered soul that I am!

However, nothing God does is common or of any fleshy sense with me. I want to live. But I have to say to pick up a cross and live a cross life just goes against my grain. That’s a paradox! I want what I want when I want it, get it?

I do have to say though, this teaching here falls right dead center with Psalms 89 and, I add that it is true with most, if not “all” your teachings in here:

Psa 89:22 The enemy shall not outwit him; the wicked shall not humble him.
Psa 89:23 I will crush his foes before him and strike down those who hate him.
Psa 89:24 My faithfulness and my steadfast love shall be with him, and in my name shall his horn be exalted.

michael
eureka, ca.

I was struck with the Law/Gospel dynamic at Acts 15 in light of David’s prayer, cited at Psalms 86.

Acts 15,

Act 15:1 But some men came down from Judea and were teaching the brothers, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.”

and

Act 15:5 But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, “It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses.”

Here is a portion of David’s prayer indicating unbelief was not on the table for him but a more sure word that he must have believed in when praying this prayer:

Psa 86:1 A Prayer of David. Incline your ear, O LORD, and answer me, for I am poor and needy.
Psa 86:2 Preserve my life, for I am godly; save your servant, who trusts in you–you are my God.
Psa 86:3 Be gracious to me, O Lord, for to you do I cry all the day.
Psa 86:4 Gladden the soul of your servant, for to you, O Lord, do I lift up my soul.
Psa 86:5 For you, O Lord, are good and forgiving, abounding in steadfast love to all who call upon you.
Psa 86:6 Give ear, O LORD, to my prayer; listen to my plea for grace.

At Acts 15, after these wonderful words of Peter, James then cites Amos 9. Amos indicates what “follows” the belief of the fallen one, King David:

Act 15:7 And after there had been much debate, Peter stood up and said to them, “Brothers, you know that in the early days God made a choice among you, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us,
Act 15:9 and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.

Here is a portion of what James spoke. What is most significant for me in these words are these “and I will restore it”:

Act 15:13 After they finished speaking, James replied, “Brothers, listen to me.
Act 15:14 Simeon has related how God first visited the Gentiles, to take from them a people for his name.
Act 15:15 And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written,
Act 15:16 “‘After this I will return, and I will rebuild the tent of David that has fallen; I will rebuild its ruins, and I will restore it,
Act 15:17 that the remnant of mankind may seek the Lord, and all the Gentiles who are called by my name, says the Lord, who makes these things
Act 15:18 known from of old.’

This chapter in Acts has so much meaning when you consider your blog as one is learning the importance of making proper distinctions between Law and Gospel.

We need the “Law” established.

We need the “Gospel” proclaimed.

It doesn’t get any simplier than that!

Michael
Eureka, Ca.

” sewer of sins “? Are those your words then or another’s?

Never thought that way before and I suppose now I have a “new” distinction to add to all the other ones!

michael
eureka, cal.